To be honest yesterday's French races continued the trend of poor races from France. I said it the other week and nothing that's happened with any organisation racing out of France these last couple of weeks has changed my mind, I'm struggling to think of a proper good race since things got back to some kind of normality these last 2 years? The reason I don't know but surely all can't be down to weather? One thing I will say that's kind of been brought up in this topic (and I'm not favoring north or south) just saying it as I see but given the difficult races this year I know if I had the choice I'd want to be one of the shorter fliers as opposed to a longer one. Obviously there are equally as good a fanciers in all parts of the country just on this year's racing I'd want to be a shorter flier. Another thing mentioned there was about 'winning' well to be honest in most national races the best pigeon isn't actually the winner (although I actually do think the best pigeon won the race yesterday, class performance by a very well fancied pigeon) Folk get too hung up on the old Red card (good for the ego) but sitting back and looking at a lot of national results, especially the longer ones, you can often see many pigeons that have put up better performances than the actual winner.French Racing
Interesting topic To be honest yesterday's French races continued the trend of poor races from France. I said it the other week and nothing that's happened with any organisation racing out of France these last couple of weeks has changed my mind, I'm struggling to think of a proper good race since things got back to some kind of normality these last 2 years? The reason I don't know but surely all can't be down to weather? One thing I will say that's kind of been brought up in this topic (and I'm not favoring north or south) just saying it as I see but given the difficult races this year I know if I had the choice I'd want to be one of the shorter fliers as opposed to a longer one. Obviously there are equally as good a fanciers in all parts of the country just on this year's racing I'd want to be a shorter flier. Another thing mentioned there was about 'winning' well to be honest in most national races the best pigeon isn't actually the winner (although I actually do think the best pigeon won the race yesterday, class performance by a very well fancied pigeon) Folk get too hung up on the old Red card (good for the ego) but sitting back and looking at a lot of national results, especially the longer ones, you can often see many pigeons that have put up better performances than the actual winner.
To be honest yesterday's French races continued the trend of poor races from France. I said it the other week and nothing that's happened with any organisation racing out of France these last couple of weeks has changed my mind, I'm struggling to think of a proper good race since things got back to some kind of normality these last 2 years? The reason I don't know but surely all can't be down to weather? One thing I will say that's kind of been brought up in this topic (and I'm not favoring north or south) just saying it as I see but given the difficult races this year I know if I had the choice I'd want to be one of the shorter fliers as opposed to a longer one. Obviously there are equally as good a fanciers in all parts of the country just on this year's racing I'd want to be a shorter flier. Another thing mentioned there was about 'winning' well to be honest in most national races the best pigeon isn't actually the winner (although I actually do think the best pigeon won the race yesterday, class performance by a very well fancied pigeon) Folk get too hung up on the old Red card (good for the ego) but sitting back and looking at a lot of national results, especially the longer ones, you can often see many pigeons that have put up better performances than the actual winner.
Last edited by goose1 on Sun Jul 21, 2024 11:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I agree Gavin
One of the best performances at Tarbes with the NFC for instance was Derek Nicholls's pigeon racing out into Barry
This is why I say don't just look at the further flier, sometimes some of the better pigeons in a convoy lie elsewhere
One of the best performances at Tarbes with the NFC for instance was Derek Nicholls's pigeon racing out into Barry
This is why I say don't just look at the further flier, sometimes some of the better pigeons in a convoy lie elsewhere
Yep agree and notice he had another handy pigeon in yesterday. A good example of a top fancier who can win/put up top performances in various locations at all levels of competition.
It was mentioned earlier on in the topic but I wouldn't fancy flying right on the south coast either as can imagine they'll be a lot of dog legging depending on where the birds hit land.
Given everything we as fanciers have to contend with these days I think it's fair to say nobody flies to an easy location, some more difficult than others but there doesn't seem to be much plain sailing for anyone anymore.
It wasn't a deflection Mike. There are many outstanding fanciers who have never Won a National but who's birds have won for others. Brian Denney up the road from me was one of the best fanciers ever to race in the NFC his birds have also won 1st National for others. M & D were outstanding fanciers also, and did win many Nationals. I asked the question simply to see you you saw their 2B & Gold ring wins as winners?MIL wrote: ↑Sun Jul 21, 2024 11:36 pm Nice deflection King - it's taken you a while to think of that
In my eyes they aren't "winners"
There's a convoy, there's a liberation, there's a winner
Simples
And as it happens, the birds of Mark Evans (who I assume you're referring to) have won many a true National as you may know
In fact, the 1st Open NFC Tarbes of 2024 is of Mark's bloodlines
Maybe that floats your boat enough?
I think we all see winners different. Many fanciers when sending in Nationals probably due to location, realistically aim first to win their section and a high open position. As Jim Biss once said (think he won around 18 Nationals) the winner of a race is not always the best bird in it.
What's you view on club winners when the bird fails to win the Fed also?
Well it was a deflection (well, an attempted one).
Now you're just talking nonsense King - not every Club winner can win the Fed
Very often the Fed winner lies in an area where you expect the Fed to be won
Sometimes it isn't. When it isn't there are 2 possible explanations
1. The race doesn't turn out as planned due to something happening once the birds are on their way (thunderstorm etc)
2. A truly exceptional pigeon can overturn the odds (sometimes). I've done it myself on numerous occasions.
Sometimes a good Fed winner is a crap pigeon. I've done it myself.
My cock that was 1st 9,531 birds was dogshit - apart from that 1 race
By the same token many of my best performances were on days when we were say 12th Fed 6,000 birds and there wasn't a pigeon within 30 miles of me on the Fed
Now you're just talking nonsense King - not every Club winner can win the Fed
Very often the Fed winner lies in an area where you expect the Fed to be won
Sometimes it isn't. When it isn't there are 2 possible explanations
1. The race doesn't turn out as planned due to something happening once the birds are on their way (thunderstorm etc)
2. A truly exceptional pigeon can overturn the odds (sometimes). I've done it myself on numerous occasions.
Sometimes a good Fed winner is a crap pigeon. I've done it myself.
My cock that was 1st 9,531 birds was dogshit - apart from that 1 race
By the same token many of my best performances were on days when we were say 12th Fed 6,000 birds and there wasn't a pigeon within 30 miles of me on the Fed
You can't have it both ways Mike. You said it yourself, one liberation one winner. You can dismiss a section winner cause it didn't win the National, then defend a club winner because it didn't win the Fed? Now you're just talking nonsense Mike - not every section winner can win the National. Your 2 possible explanations also apply to National racing.MIL wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 12:06 am Well it was a deflection (well, an attempted one).
Now you're just talking nonsense King - not every Club winner can win the Fed
Very often the Fed winner lies in an area where you expect the Fed to be won
Sometimes it isn't. When it isn't there are 2 possible explanations
1. The race doesn't turn out as planned due to something happening once the birds are on their way (thunderstorm etc)
2. A truly exceptional pigeon can overturn the odds (sometimes). I've done it myself on numerous occasions.
Sometimes a good Fed winner is a crap pigeon. I've done it myself.
My cock that was 1st 9,531 birds was dogshit - apart from that 1 race
By the same token many of my best performances were on days when we were say 12th Fed 6,000 birds and there wasn't a pigeon within 30 miles of me on the Fed
But I do encourage fair judgement on a pigeon regardless of where it flies (regardless of the competition)
I don't just bash my bishop because its a further flying pigeon
Like i've said before, sometimes the best pigeons can lie in any corner of the radius of a race
I don't just bash my bishop because its a further flying pigeon
Like i've said before, sometimes the best pigeons can lie in any corner of the radius of a race
Mike why as a Northern fancier would I not sing the praises of the longer flying birds? Whilst I'll give credit to a Winner wherever it maybe, like Gavin I look for outstanding performances within the race. It's near impossible to find SHORTER flying birds than the race winner with an outstanding performance?MIL wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 12:25 am But I do encourage fair judgement on a pigeon regardless of where it flies (regardless of the competition)
I don't just bash my bishop because its a further flying pigeon
Like i've said before, sometimes the best pigeons can lie in any corner of the radius of a race
On my first post on this thread I said 'The winning bird was an exceptional performance, it lead the race from start to finish'
And your free to bash ya bishop whenever you choose. I for one won't judge you.
I don’t know much about these races
In my thinking if there was a due east wind and a bird was home up the top of the National result to say Suffolk or Norfolk but the national was one north of Manchester flying 150 miles more would the pigeon timed to the east not be the better pigeon
Only reading a lot of your posts although mixed up a bit and covering various outcomes Kings s post seem to be more about giving recognition with the longest flying bird in the day
In my thinking if there was a due east wind and a bird was home up the top of the National result to say Suffolk or Norfolk but the national was one north of Manchester flying 150 miles more would the pigeon timed to the east not be the better pigeon
Only reading a lot of your posts although mixed up a bit and covering various outcomes Kings s post seem to be more about giving recognition with the longest flying bird in the day