The thing is about the sport.

[king]

I could give you loads of examples of sprint races being won by a large margin to my own loft (at Fed level)

For instance my cock "Lee" won the Fed by almost 5 min from 140 miles. He was literally miles clear

My Pitbull Queen won the NMCC from Portland by almost 5 mins - again miles clear

I can also give you numerous examples at other lofts

Just let me know if you want them - not documented them at this moment 'cos I wouldn't wanna bore you

I too have won by a clear 10 mins inland and so have many others Mike, but NOBODY knows when that bird broke clear? What is fact that birds fly faster in a flock, so somewhere on route these breakaway winners leave the pack they are racing with and head for home. And since a fancier can only see the end of the race he is only guessing when or where his winner LEFT the flock. It it very unlikely that it's at the race p[oint as a single bird could not possibly fly quicker the whole way home than the racing pack and still be mins in front of them?
[/quote

Was it 10 min clear in the fed king ? What kind of vels

No it finished 3rd Fed 1600s

[MIL]

How would you know this Mike?

I practice what I preach King

I'm a 2 x West Midlands Region Sprint Champion in the 0-250 miles category and in 2005 I was 2nd National Ace Sprint Champion of the UK

People can liker or loathe me (it doesn't keep me awake at night) but I know sprinting

[NeilA]

I too have won by a clear 10 mins inland and so have many others Mike, but NOBODY knows when that bird broke clear? What is fact that birds fly faster in a flock, so somewhere on route these breakaway winners leave the pack they are racing with and head for home. And since a fancier can only see the end of the race he is only guessing when or where his winner LEFT the flock. It it very unlikely that it's at the race p[oint as a single bird could not possibly fly quicker the whole way home than the racing pack and still be mins in front of them?
[/quote

Was it 10 min clear in the fed king ? What kind of vels

No it finished 3rd Fed 1600s

That’s not 10 min clear though, king still did well but it didn’t win by 10 mins

[king]

How would you know this Mike?

I practice what I preach King

I'm a 2 x West Midlands Region Sprint Champion in the 0-250 miles category and in 2005 I was 2nd National Ace Sprint Champion of the UK

People can liker or loathe me (it doesn't keep me awake at night) but I know sprinting

Mike I'm not doubting your racing ability, and certainly don't loathe you, (if I did I wouldn't bother replying on the thread) I asked how you would know if your birds circled the race point or not? And does it matter if they are still winning the race?

[MIL]

My birds don't circle in training so why should they on a Saturday?

Whenever my birds went in the basket to them its a race. They don't know they're only "training"

[Andy]

When my cocks is are really right and I train they don’t circle they scare me as there low just above head height when there not right they circle 2/3 times I notice
I remember year before last I had never seen them leave the lib point so fast about 15 feet off the floor I let 11 go
I had 7 drop to win the fed on the Saturday so would that not work at a race point
I have a pal that use to convoy a 6 bird club and a fed the 6 bird is the money races he tells me it’s remarkable the difference in the speed of the two libs I imagine the cream is in the 6 bird

In my opinion if birds are not clearing the liberation site instantly then their heads are not right and I'd be treating them

Cos I tell you mine would clear without looking sideways and if yours circle 3-4 times I'm the best part of a mile up the road and you aint gonna catch that up without help from a BoP

There are occasions where the liberations can be a disaster and not even the best birds get away. There was one liberation from the race course last year that I commented on at the time where one liberation was at 11.30. 10 minutes later there were still big batches of birds going always. They didn’t have a clue. The second liberation was at 12.00. Same result, 10 minutes of birds going in all directions in large batches. Mark Gilbert had a lot of pigeons in the first lib. They got home eventually well split and very low velocities. So none broke away that day.

[Andy]

My birds don't circle in training so why should they on a Saturday?

Whenever my birds went in the basket to them its a race. They don't know they're only "training"

I’m not disagreeing with you Mike but training birds all going to the same loft is totally different than when they are liberated with hundreds of others. As I said I have seen a single bird turn a whole convoy.

[NeilA]

You do get crap races like that Andy we had one this year a lad who hadn’t won a club card all year won the fed
We don’t really know why it happened we suspected peregrines at the site scaring the ybs but we don’t really know

[king]

My birds don't circle in training so why should they on a Saturday?

Whenever my birds went in the basket to them its a race. They don't know they're only "training"

Ha Mike so you assuming they do the same as training? and you really don't actually know what they do when racing.

[MIL]

When they are in the air they're anybody's we know this

But give me the choice I'd rather have one out on its own than with a pack

If its with others why do I deserve to win?